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	<title>Comments for συνεσταύρωμαι: living the crucified life</title>
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		<title>Comment on Pentecostal Pastor Arrested in Iran by Dave Black</title>
		<link>http://sunestauromai.wordpress.com/2013/05/22/pentecostal-pastor-arrested-in-iran/#comment-7187</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Dave Black]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 23 May 2013 12:22:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://sunestauromai.wordpress.com/?p=5824#comment-7187</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Prayer going up!]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Prayer going up!</p>
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		<title>Comment on Pentecostal Pastor Arrested in Iran by brianroden</title>
		<link>http://sunestauromai.wordpress.com/2013/05/22/pentecostal-pastor-arrested-in-iran/#comment-7184</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[brianroden]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 22 May 2013 23:33:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://sunestauromai.wordpress.com/?p=5824#comment-7184</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Also saw this on an email from Elam Ministries 

Sent from my TARDISphone]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Also saw this on an email from Elam Ministries </p>
<p>Sent from my TARDISphone</p>
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		<title>Comment on on pastors as servants and stewards by Tim Froehlke</title>
		<link>http://sunestauromai.wordpress.com/2011/02/08/on-pastors-as-servants-and-stewards/#comment-7183</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Tim Froehlke]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 22 May 2013 14:18:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://sunestauromai.wordpress.com/?p=4188#comment-7183</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Maybe one reason pastors and others are burning out on church has to do with the structure of church.

Up until about 200 years ago &quot;we&quot; meant your family. When &quot;we&quot; started to be society, it marked a major turning point in the transition to a collectivized world. Satan has been guiding the world to this collectivization to advance his own purposes. He cannot be everywhere at once and needs to leverage his influence to increase his control.

I would suggest that unsaved people can only be collectivized so far. Feudal Japan probably represents the highest level of collectivization possible naturally. To really collectivize the world, Satan needed Christians who were able to sublimate their selfishness to such a degree as to construct social institutions that would not be so easily torn apart.

Key to this was the church as a system and institution. Once people could be sufficiently bound to these systems, they could be transferred to political and corporate collectives and technology could provide the tools to maintain the collective without the need for Christians any more.

As a measure of how far this process of collectivization has come, one has to only consider why people do not start a family business like a grocery store, hardware store, or gas station any more. There is little room for individuals to work outside the collective.

For those of us drawn by the Father to Jesus, we can consider that the means that is used is truth. It is a perception of, desire for, and recognition of truth that draws us to Jesus who is truth. However, those who are drawn to truth often are puzzled over the institution and function of church. If we try to view the church as a mechanism of truth, we find it hard to see where programs, events, activities, classes, and lectures accomplish this.

The only people we can &quot;sell&quot; on the idea of church are those who already are resonant with these collectivized systems.

I have found it better to seek those who are seeking truth and tell them about Jesus. Bringing these people to a church may not help them to grow into the image of Christ. It is sad but it looks like any real Christian progress needs to be conducted outside of mechanical church systems.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Maybe one reason pastors and others are burning out on church has to do with the structure of church.</p>
<p>Up until about 200 years ago &#8220;we&#8221; meant your family. When &#8220;we&#8221; started to be society, it marked a major turning point in the transition to a collectivized world. Satan has been guiding the world to this collectivization to advance his own purposes. He cannot be everywhere at once and needs to leverage his influence to increase his control.</p>
<p>I would suggest that unsaved people can only be collectivized so far. Feudal Japan probably represents the highest level of collectivization possible naturally. To really collectivize the world, Satan needed Christians who were able to sublimate their selfishness to such a degree as to construct social institutions that would not be so easily torn apart.</p>
<p>Key to this was the church as a system and institution. Once people could be sufficiently bound to these systems, they could be transferred to political and corporate collectives and technology could provide the tools to maintain the collective without the need for Christians any more.</p>
<p>As a measure of how far this process of collectivization has come, one has to only consider why people do not start a family business like a grocery store, hardware store, or gas station any more. There is little room for individuals to work outside the collective.</p>
<p>For those of us drawn by the Father to Jesus, we can consider that the means that is used is truth. It is a perception of, desire for, and recognition of truth that draws us to Jesus who is truth. However, those who are drawn to truth often are puzzled over the institution and function of church. If we try to view the church as a mechanism of truth, we find it hard to see where programs, events, activities, classes, and lectures accomplish this.</p>
<p>The only people we can &#8220;sell&#8221; on the idea of church are those who already are resonant with these collectivized systems.</p>
<p>I have found it better to seek those who are seeking truth and tell them about Jesus. Bringing these people to a church may not help them to grow into the image of Christ. It is sad but it looks like any real Christian progress needs to be conducted outside of mechanical church systems.</p>
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		<title>Comment on on avenues for minsitry by Brian Fulthorp</title>
		<link>http://sunestauromai.wordpress.com/2013/05/20/on-avenues-for-minsitry/#comment-7177</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Brian Fulthorp]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 20 May 2013 19:55:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://sunestauromai.wordpress.com/?p=5820#comment-7177</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Thank you Shawn, I appreciate that!  ]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thank you Shawn, I appreciate that!  </p>
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		<title>Comment on on avenues for minsitry by chazon1</title>
		<link>http://sunestauromai.wordpress.com/2013/05/20/on-avenues-for-minsitry/#comment-7176</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[chazon1]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 20 May 2013 18:34:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://sunestauromai.wordpress.com/?p=5820#comment-7176</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[You&#039;re a very gifted writer, Brian. Thanks for this...]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You&#8217;re a very gifted writer, Brian. Thanks for this&#8230;</p>
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		<title>Comment on C.S. Lewis &#8212; Why He Matters Today by Brian Fulthorp</title>
		<link>http://sunestauromai.wordpress.com/2013/05/11/c-s-lewis-why-he-matters-today/#comment-7165</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Brian Fulthorp]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 12 May 2013 16:48:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://sunestauromai.wordpress.com/?p=5817#comment-7165</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Well, he isn&#039;t in office anymore so... who knows?]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Well, he isn&#8217;t in office anymore so&#8230; who knows?</p>
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		<title>Comment on C.S. Lewis &#8212; Why He Matters Today by Mark Stevens</title>
		<link>http://sunestauromai.wordpress.com/2013/05/11/c-s-lewis-why-he-matters-today/#comment-7164</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Mark Stevens]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 11 May 2013 20:08:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://sunestauromai.wordpress.com/?p=5817#comment-7164</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Metaxas&#039; book has an endorsement from George W Bush. Now I am not making a political comment but I find that to be one of the strangest endorsements I&#039;ve ever come across!]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Metaxas&#8217; book has an endorsement from George W Bush. Now I am not making a political comment but I find that to be one of the strangest endorsements I&#8217;ve ever come across!</p>
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		<title>Comment on Help a Brother Out?? by whalbright</title>
		<link>http://sunestauromai.wordpress.com/2013/04/09/help-a-brother-out/#comment-7149</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[whalbright]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 05 May 2013 03:30:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://sunestauromai.wordpress.com/?p=5803#comment-7149</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Keener all the way.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Keener all the way.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>Comment on NT Theology quote of the day by passage of the day: John 3:16-21 &#124; συνεσταύρωμαι: living the crucified life</title>
		<link>http://sunestauromai.wordpress.com/2009/02/19/nt-theology-quote-of-the-day/#comment-7144</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[passage of the day: John 3:16-21 &#124; συνεσταύρωμαι: living the crucified life]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 30 Apr 2013 00:53:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://sunestauromai.wordpress.com/?p=1587#comment-7144</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[[...] dei.  I don&#8217;t own the book but I know Howard Marshall in his NT Theology talks about how New Testament Theology is missionary theology.   I think he is exactly right!  And I think the whole thrust of John&#8217;s letters is [...]]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] dei.  I don&#8217;t own the book but I know Howard Marshall in his NT Theology talks about how New Testament Theology is missionary theology.   I think he is exactly right!  And I think the whole thrust of John&#8217;s letters is [...]</p>
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		<title>Comment on Jesus Christ: Savior and Lord? by Gary</title>
		<link>http://sunestauromai.wordpress.com/2008/08/06/jesus-christ-lord-and-savior/#comment-7131</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Gary]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 23 Apr 2013 13:41:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://sunestauromai.wordpress.com/?p=528#comment-7131</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[The date of your post and it&#039;s current relevance is telling -- it&#039;s timeless and will still be pondered by sincere Chistians many years from now.  For me He is first Savior, and my obedience is a reaction to that love.  Love-motivated obedience is very powerful and has blessed me beyond my ability to express it.  My heart aches for the many Christians who stop at Savior and don&#039;t discover the transforming power of loving obedience.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The date of your post and it&#8217;s current relevance is telling &#8212; it&#8217;s timeless and will still be pondered by sincere Chistians many years from now.  For me He is first Savior, and my obedience is a reaction to that love.  Love-motivated obedience is very powerful and has blessed me beyond my ability to express it.  My heart aches for the many Christians who stop at Savior and don&#8217;t discover the transforming power of loving obedience.</p>
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